Why Your Personal Brand Is Your Most Valuable Asset

Isaac Mashman0:56

Richard, I'm honored to be here, man, and I need to get one of those nice intros made. That was pretty nice. I enjoyed that. But thank you for having me on, man.

Isaac Mashman1:33

Yeah, absolutely. So I'm originally from Jacksonville, Florida. I don't come from money. I don't come from an entrepreneurial background. Quite the opposite. Single parent household. I remember my mom, brilliant lady, very smart lady, working just jobs to get by, and we were living with my grandparents at the time. Growing up, it was impressed upon me to go to school, get good grades, and get a job. [That's] the stereotypical entrepreneur story, the story of somebody who doesn't come from money. That's exactly what I did. I'm not one of the entrepreneurs who could say I was a [D or F] student. I was actually a straight A student on track to go to college with a [Bright Futures] scholarship to Florida State or UCF.

Needed to take an SAT test, get 10 extra points, and I would have been there. So very book smart, but I recognized, why am I going to go to college and get a degree? I love my mom, but she wasn't even putting her degree to use. So I ended up seeing a bunch of these younger guys that were involved in the network marketing industry. I just saw a couple of different people, over the span of about two years, with their own business, with their own clothing line, with their own, honestly, accomplishments. I thought I could do the same exact thing. So senior year of high school, I got my clothing line [going] and, it was super stupid, but I remember wearing my hoodie around school and just thinking, man, this is nice.

This is cool. I ended up getting into the network marketing industry. Three different companies, four different times. I never saw success, but I had a lot of dream building experiences that added up over time. Then from there, it went from managing musical talent for six months, and wanting to do a record label, to eventually deciding that I was going to launch Mashman Ventures. But the funny thing is, I didn't even know what Mashman Ventures was. It took me six months to define it as a public relations firm. Then I had these eureka moments, just saying, hey, personal branding is going to be the focus. Because everybody online was focusing on companies and social media agencies and media agencies.

I'm thinking to myself, man, there's so much competition. I hate the done for you space. I don't like doing that. So why not focus on personal brands? And fast forward to today, it's been great. It's been a lot of fun, a lot of challenges, but I can't complain.

Isaac Mashman4:48

Yeah, to a degree, I think that both are equally as important. But look, I'm on the podcast not because of Vertical Momentum. I'm on the podcast because of you, because we have been connected one on one. Influencer marketing has been around since the early days of Hollywood. You used to see the old man's man, John Wayne, or any of the old country guys smoking [Marlboro], like the cigarette brands. They would represent the cigarette brands. That was a form of celebrity or influencer marketing. But today that playing field is so leveled out. Anybody can be an influencer, and everybody to a degree is an influencer. But once you understand how to leverage that and direct it towards a business, or in the case of Michael Jordan, he's getting paid for the shoes.

He's getting paid for the advertisements. Just the other day I saw Shaquille O'Neal on an Epson printer commercial for the advertising printer. I never thought in a million years I'd see Shaq on a printer commercial, but here we are. But that's the thing, who he was, who he is, that has weight and that can trigger a buying decision.

Isaac Mashman6:46

Yeah, that's a good point, and that's something that growing up I was never really aware of. Then I realized that hey, there's a method to all of the madness. Growing up I was the kind of kid who was reading the Lysol bottle, trying to pronounce all the different chemicals. But looking back, hindsight's 2020, I'm realizing that I wasn't just reading all the different things. I was paying attention to how the package was manufactured, to where the logo was, what the placement was, what the design was. I'm not so much in the realm of product design, but it was still a form of marketing, saying, hey, the number one disinfectant, or things like that.

But a great example would be, if you go into a restaurant, a lot of restaurants are blue because blue is going to stimulate you to get more. The plates are a certain size and a certain color. Or you see the color green, and green is associated with growth. It's associated with money, with wealth. If you were to think about Cash App, the Cash App logo is green, with the white money sign. You have LinkedIn, and most every other social media network has blue because blue is trustworthy. It's calm, it's soothing, and you want to keep people soothed and calm and on the application, regardless of Facebook raising blood pressure nowadays.

Then you think about black and white. My entire branding is black and white. My website's black and white. I'm wearing a black t-shirt, a black hat. My hoodies are black and white. It's not that I'm depressed and I don't like any colors, but it's very simply because it gives you that sense of the modern aesthetic, that modern sense. So every single time I'm working with a client, [I ask,] well, what is your favorite color? From there, I'll kind of branch out and be like, all right, well, if you're trying to be this alpha figure, this in your face kind of figure that is getting all the attention, that subtle lavender color might not be the best choice.

But red is a call to action. Red is a powerful color, and a lot of the buy now buttons that you'll see are actually red because it's triggering that color. Or, [red] can oftentimes be associated with valor, with blood, the military. Thinking about color and emotions, we think about camouflage. I know a lot of the listeners are veterans and thank you all for your service. But I mean, the uniforms that you wear have a reason. The khakis blend in with the sand, the camouflage blends in with the forest. So all those different things have implications not just in the physical world, but into the psychological world as well, influencing decisions, influencing buying behaviors, influencing feelings and emotions. That's what's fascinating to me.

Isaac Mashman10:02

Well, a lot of people do wait. Again, whenever you're starting out, you have a million different ideas, a million different directions. [Take] myself. Man, I didn't figure out half of this stuff. I was previously calling Mashman Ventures a multi-purpose company, like it was a paper towel, like a multi-purpose towelette. Then it took me six months to define it. So looking back, I was an idiot for doing that, but when you're in the beginning stages, you're like, man, you think that every single thing that you do is the best thing ever. You should maintain that attitude. However, and I mentioned this in my book, take an extra two weeks to get the branding right and to kind of get a couple things cemented.

You don't need to have some massive business plan, but you need to have kind of an idea of what you want the brand to be, and the feeling whenever people are checking it out. What feeling are they getting? Do they feel like it's a luxury brand? Do they feel like it's something that they can relate to or bring home? So you have to kind of get these different things figured out and then you launch, because what will happen if your brand sucks? For example, your buddy's book, I'm sure the contents of the book were freaking fantastic. But on the other hand, if the cover isn't appealing and it doesn't trigger somebody to pick up the book, how will they ever know what is inside of the book?

So that's the same thing with your brand. If your brand looks mediocre, then how do you expect somebody to ever check out what you have going on? Then your marketing and your conversions are going to be extremely low. But if you market yourself and the brand is sucky, the conversions are not going to translate either. So it's a two-way street to where if your marketing is rough, then you could have the greatest brand in the world and nobody would know the products. But if your branding sucks, the conversions will suck. So taking a little bit of extra time to kind of figure out those different things I would 100% recommend doing.

Isaac Mashman12:54

Well, I can't help but think about Netflix making the same mistakes Blockbuster did. I know with multiple streaming services, you'll go and you'll just scroll for three hours before you find something that's worth watching. Then you'll finally watch and you're like, wow, I spent half my time on this one platform. And Netflix, I know, has lost a massive consumer base because they're not evolving. They're not looking to the next thing. I think that companies, if we think about Coca-Cola, they don't need to do marketing. Coca-Cola has all of the market share in the world practically for soda and such, but they are still running advertisements.

They're still doing sponsorships. They're still creating new products, creating new flavors, getting into more stores and more hands and more places. A lot of times whenever you're building a business, you can get in this one track mind, where you're only focusing on one thing and you're not thinking about, hey, what can I do to spread and expand? So if you're at a point where your business is kind of at a stalemate, I would say number one, that would be the time that you need to go harder at it and actually see what creative ways you can go about creating a new offer. There have been multiple times over the past year where I'm thinking to myself, maybe this is flawed.

That takes a certain character to kind of take a step back and say, hey, let me go ahead and change the model. So previously for Mashman Ventures, if I could be transparent, we were charging based off of consultations for an entire year. We weren't charging based off a retainer. Then one client came to me and he's like, I want a refund for the rest of the year. I'm like, we've already done eight consultations. We weren't doing it on a month to month basis. I realized that the model was slightly flawed. I could go ahead and make it a little bit better. So I saw that and I was thinking to myself, okay, what is the next step?

It was uncomfortable to go to that next stage and say, let me go ahead and get in this retainer model and actually get a 20 page contract written up, but it's the next stage. A lot of times we fail to take those next steps because we're uncomfortable. We're like, I really don't want to do this. I don't want to spend the time, when actually spending that time and stepping away from your day-to-day actions can help you scale in a tremendous way. But you have to actually take a step back to ever do that. That's something that I've seen a lot of people do. They get so focused on, oh, if I take myself out of the business, and it's like, no, you're still in the business, but your focus is on helping the business expand.

Isaac Mashman16:10

Well, let's talk about reputation management, because that's honestly what it is. If you put out one shitty product, everybody's going to think [badly of the company]. And this is actually, there's an effect called the halo effect, and an effect called the horn effect. Not many people know about these. The halo effect is when you base your entire opinion and perspective on something or a product or someone off of one particular trait. So a great example would be the Amber Heard and Johnny Depp trial that's going on right now. People have been fans of Johnny Depp for decades and they're automatically like, I cannot believe for one second he did any of the things that he was accused of.

That is a form of the halo effect. Oh, he is like some God that is perfect. Now, not stating any opinions on the subject matter, but then you also have the horn effect, which works the opposite way, where one negative experience, one negative trait about a person, can influence your entire perspective of the company or the person as a whole. So let's say an example would be if you're bald, and let's say you had a teacher in third grade that was bald that you absolutely hated, and just because another person was bald, you automatically didn't like him. That is a form of the horn effect.

Or you have one bad experience with a company or a restaurant, and you never go back, or you assume that everything, every single other [dish] at that restaurant, is also bad. That might not be the case. Everything else might be great. You just had that one bad experience, but that influenced and triggered you to think that all of a sudden it was bad. Kia is a great example of a brand that is reimagining itself, and I can't help but mention it because have you seen the cars lately?

Isaac Mashman17:50

Four years ago Kia, I see the logo, I'm thinking cheap car, cheap American car. That's the only thing I'm thinking about. Now Kia does the new logo, it looks good, unlike a lot of the brands that now want to get this minimalist design, this futuristic design, and they butcher it, but Kia did it right. They designed the cars from looking like something a college student would drive to this new thing. My favorite commercial of all time that I've ever seen is actually by Kia. It was the guy who's on the beach and he's driving one of the Kia SUVs. He has a big rake behind him that he's dragging in the vehicle, and he's picking up trash, and then you see the sea turtles.

That is an example of, I would not be surprised if they had a public relations firm that was saying, what can we do to make the public think of Kia in a different light? You have to think about how people are perceiving your company. Are they perceiving your company as just another social media agency? Are they seeing your company as the social media agency that they need to be working [with]? This is why I'm particularly big about personal branding and building out your story, because that is how you can say, hey, I am the person behind this company. This is me. This is where I'm pouring out my blood, sweat and tears.

People who know you are automatically going to want to work with the company because of who's associated with it. That is a fantastic way to get free branding and free marketing, and also showing your personal side, the fact that you're a veteran, the fact that you work for a nonprofit, the fact that you're Christian or the fact that you're somebody who loves coffee, is a way to establish rapport and trust and get people to follow you for who you are, the man or the woman that you are. That can be transmitted into so many different avenues of increasing your business. That's the way that I think is the future. More and more people are understanding that, hey, I'm the face of the business, and I put myself out there as such.

Isaac Mashman19:50

Fantastic. I love that. Branding is what people know you as, or what people know the product or the company as. Marketing is how you get more people to know about who you are or what it is you do. Branding is who you are, marketing is the numbers game. So for example, you're Richard Kaufman. I'm Isaac Mashman. So that's your personal brand. This is my personal brand. Then we would start influencing the person into thinking about us for something in particular. You know me for personal branding, I know you for the podcast, I know you for the other things that make you you. Then marketing is how do you get more people to know that I know about personal branding?

How do I get more people to know about my name or know what I have going on? This also works for companies as well. Coca-Cola is the brand and it's not just the logo, but it's also the colors behind it. It's the mission, it's what it stands for. It's the taste, it's the products. It's all of the different things that come together to shape Coca-Cola as it is, because whenever you launch a company, you have to give that company characteristics. You have to give it traits. You have to give it a message. You have to give it a name. Then now Coca-Cola is running advertisements, or they had the polar bears, which is a form of marketing.

I don't know if you ever saw the [Icee] machines that had the polar bear in the convenience stores, in the gas stations. One of the happiest memories from my childhood is going into the gas station after school with my grandparents, my grandmother and my grandfather. I'd get a big 30 ounce Coca-Cola [Icee] slushy. That is actually a form of marketing because you have the Coca-Cola logo, but now they have another fan. So there's so many different forms of marketing. Then with your brand, there's so many different aspects that make up your brand.

Isaac Mashman22:53

Great example would be musical artists, the artists that you listen to. They don't make money off of streams. They make some money, but a lot of that money goes back to the record label and paying off their advances. They get paid off of going on tours and selling merchandise and stuff. That's why, not to get off topic, but if you've ever heard of a 360 record deal, that's one of the worst deals an artist could get into because now the record label is taking a share of their tours, of their streams, of their merchandise, of everything. One of the first things I did when I was younger, whenever I did my clothing line, is I got t-shirts made, or, you know, hoodies made, and I was wearing them everywhere.

I think this also comes from not growing up with money in my family. It was, let's go to the thrift store and grab some t-shirts and grab a pair of shoes, and I hated it growing up, but I never really wore name-brand stuff. Then now as I got older, my hat, I don't have my logo. I need to get some custom embroidered hats soon. But I'm not wearing anybody's logo, and when I do get something made, the only one that I'm going to feel proud of representing is my own. People are afraid to put themselves out there because of honestly how they were raised. Oh, don't talk to strangers, don't make it about yourself, don't talk about what you've got going on, when in actuality that's what's required to be known.

I was recently reading an essay by Andrew Carnegie and he said that [one] must attract attention. You have to attract attention to yourself. That does not mean, and this is not the equivalent of, being a narcissist and being some egomaniac who's just like, oh, I'm better than you. It's very simply saying, hey, I'm somebody who's immensely proud and excited about what I have going on and what I'm building, and I want the world to know about it. Also understand, how can you expect to help more people, further your cause, and get in front of more audiences if you're not talking and sharing about yourself? And how do you expect other people to talk about you if you don't want to talk about yourself?

Isaac Mashman25:38

Crazy. We're about to hit the halfway mark of this year. I was just talking to my girlfriend, like, what the heck happened this year? Personal branding, more and more people are going to hear the term and fewer and fewer people are going to understand what the hell it means. Here's the thing, personal branding has been around, but let's go ahead and define what personal branding is first because we haven't even had that conversation. It's you, it's who you are. It is not something that you create a new one of. This is a misconception that a lot of people have. A lot of people think they have to create a new personal brand.

You don't have to create a new personal brand. You simply have to further the personal brand that you've had since the moment you were born. When you were born, your parents determined your name, where you were born, the political affiliation, what religion you were part of, what schools you went to, and then as a child you start building out your personal brand. So you're not creating a new one. You're furthering the one that you've already had. Personal branding also goes back thousands of years. Since the beginning of mankind, you have certain barbarians on the plains of Mesopotamia that were more feared than others. You had kings in England who ruled by divine right and they literally maintained power because people thought of them for something and they're like, this is my king.

What are kings? People with a personal brand, and the personal brand is keeping them in power. We have so many other examples throughout history. Moving forward, many people believe that personal branding comes from Napoleon Hill, actually, because in his chapter Organized Planning in Think and Grow Rich, he talks about putting together a portfolio, which is a buffed up resume of basically all of the different things about you and your profession that make you stand out from other potential [hires]. Now, a lot of people today are just going to be getting on social media and just expecting attention, anticipating attention. Now, if I were to drop the one answer that will make you stand out, it's that you have to position yourself as a public figure.

That is how you cut through the noise because you have all of this noise going on around you. The reason I have no issue even mentioning this is because this is literally the key, like Napoleon Hill says, the master key, Charles F. [Haanel] says, The Master Key System. This is the master key of personal branding. This is what I have used to be able to get and cut through the noise and get mentioned and get press and all these other things. You have to position yourself as a public figure, as a celebrity and as somebody that, if somebody was not following or was not talking to them, they would feel like they were missing out.

Because by 2025, not even 10 years, there are going to be 4 billion people [online]. The continent of Africa is developing at a rapid rate. You're going to see more users coming on from there, from India growing into the tech giant that it is today, all around the world. That means that you're going to have a lot of people that are fighting for attention. Everybody's creating content and nobody's getting through and it's just everybody in each other's echo chambers. It's going to require you taking yourself seriously, treating your personal brand like a business and doing things that are going to stand out from everybody else. That will be the way that you stand out.

Isaac Mashman29:05

You do things that build your credibility, and credibility is trust. It is this understanding that to the general public, to a stranger, they can trust you. This is also quite remarkable because your goal should not be to know everybody. Your goal should be to get everybody to know you. Then whenever somebody comes to you and they say, hey, I've been following you for 20 years, you're like, oh, great. Johnny, nice to meet you. Tell me about yourself. But that doesn't mean you knew Johnny 20 years ago. It just means that Johnny knows you. So some of the things to establish credibility and to stand out as that public figure, verification is absolutely important.

I will say this, number one. I might run a public relations firm, but I'm not one of the PR guys. It's like, pay me a thousand bucks. I'll get you in Yahoo Finance and Forbes. I'll get you the verification badge. That's not how I operate. I've done everything, and I always work with my clients to build [it] organically. I want to go ahead and put that disclosure out there because there are a lot of people selling this idea that you can fake and buy your credibility. You really can't because it's going to hurt it in the long term. But a verification badge is something that makes you stand out.

Putting public figure and switching to a professional profile is something that makes you stand out. Being omnipresent, which means that you're everywhere all the time, having multiple social media channels, not just Facebook, not just LinkedIn, but Twitter and Instagram and TikTok and diversifying your content. There is software out there that you can buy and invest in that will help you post your content across a variety of channels. We're streaming right now to Lord knows how many different platforms, all at once. Not like you're going and uploading the video to every single place. You're uploading because software and technology is here allowing you to do so.

That's how you diversify yourself and say, hey, I'm not just one of these guys that's only on one platform, I'm everywhere. I want you to know about me. Then you're going to get featured in press and talk about your business. Talk about what you have going on. Now, not everybody, I understand this as well, is going to want to become well known nationally or internationally. But even in your local market, have you ever considered, instead of watching the people on the morning news channel being interviewed, being one of the people at the news channel being interviewed? Have you ever switched positions? Those people are there because they decided to put themselves there, because they wanted to go ahead and be on the public side.

So have you ever thought about what you can do to get in the public as well? Most people don't ask themselves that question, but that is what it takes.

Isaac Mashman32:24

No, go ahead. No, I was just going to say, if you, for example, write a book, have you ever considered donating a book to your local library, to every single library in town? Libraries accept donations, so why don't you donate your own book? Why don't you get it in schools? I'm going to eventually. I need to actually give the founder of my school a call, but I want to send 10 copies of my book to my high school, to my middle school, to the elementary school. I want to go ahead and get the book in as many hands as possible. That's honestly the mentality it takes.

It's interesting. I've been reflecting on this quite a bit, Richard, on where the line is between the importance of having the proper mindset and the proper execution. Because a lot of personal branding and breaking through the noise, the concepts and the tactics and the strategies are relatively easy. They're time consuming, but they're easy. But the mindset and the mentality to get there and to do those things is the difficult part. I always cover mindset training whenever I'm working with somebody because if you lack the ability to talk about yourself, you're going to lack the overall results that potentially exist. So interesting conversation, but regardless.

Isaac Mashman34:12

I oftentimes say that to try to build your legacy while you're alive is to take away from the time that you're going to have here on Earth. But your legacy is something that you build naturally with how big you build your life, and you have different levels of legacy such as being well known to your family. But truthfully, I don't know my great-great-grandparents' names. I don't know their names. I just have to be honest. The reason why is because [they] didn't do anything that was remarkable aside from give birth and provide for my great-grandparents. Other than that, there's nothing. However, there's this video, and I need to find out who it is so I can credit him, but he's talking and he's mentioning all of these different brands.

He's like, Rolls-Royce, last name. He's going through all of [them]. I do not know what video that is or who that guy is. However, all of the brands today, Rockefeller Center, John D. Rockefeller, Andrew Carnegie, [Carnegie] Hall, all of these different people you know because of the personal brands. So anybody, I know I've had people in the past be like, personal branding doesn't exist. I'm like, all right, that's why defamation trials exist. Because personal branding doesn't matter, your reputation doesn't matter. But building something big is naturally going to result in you being remembered for something. For as much as I'm not focusing on building legacy, I actually wrote my book in such a way to where even if I died tomorrow, the principles will remain.

A lot of the things that people do now are literally only for the next two years. They're thinking, I can do it. Let me go out and write a book. The book is only going to be applicable for two or three years. I can't help but think about certain books that I've read about social media talking about strategies that worked five years ago. I'm like, how do you expect me to pick this up a decade from now and still get value from it, when [the platform] isn't around or doesn't exist anymore? So with my book, instead of talking about specific strategies, I talked about principles, I talked about philosophies, I talked about things that will exist no matter the kind of medium.

That's how you stand out. So go into it with the end in mind in the sense of, hey, is this going to be perceived properly? Understand too that one thing is going to lead to another. So Mashman Ventures isn't my end-all be-all. It's one company that I'm working [on], because one of the things that I learned in network marketing was you have to have a vehicle. You have to have a vehicle towards success. At that time everybody's like, this network marketing company is your vehicle. I'm like, yes, sir, I agree, it's my vehicle. I got out of the companies, but I realized I needed another vehicle to fund Mashman Properties, to fund my investments, to fund my other things.

When I launch a coffee brand and I fight with Richard for market share, I need capital for that. We're going to collaborate on that. So we're going to, exactly. Honestly, at this point, I'm like, I don't want to go through all that. There's so much that goes into it. Whenever I, okay, so whenever I want [to open a] coffee shop and I need coffee beans, I need to pay [Richard] to get his coffee beans in this store. There we go. But again, that requires capital and cash flow. So I'm like, Mashman Ventures is my vehicle, but it's not my end-all be-all. It's going to lead to a dozen other companies and a dozen other ventures.

So understand how your things today are going to add up. A lot of times, especially when you're beginning to build out your personal brand, you might not care about one new follower. You might not care about one new interaction. You might not give two [shits], truthfully. Over time, you might not see the benefit. Then all of a sudden you do. All of a sudden you realize that that random Facebook connection that you added is actually the person who is the reporter for that big news site. Or [it's] that client that's been watching you. Or in this case, Richard, you've been going back and forth, but I really haven't ever had a one-on-one conversation with you.

Yet at the same time, you've been watching and supporting me and following me and paying attention. I've been doing the same. Who knows what results this podcast will bring about, who it can help. So it's like those little things do add up over time. Sometimes they might not have that instant ROI and that's okay.

Isaac Mashman39:15

Yeah, every single person that you come in contact with, your aim should be to leave a lasting impression of increase. They need to feel better leaving that conversation than they did coming into the conversation. A lot of times people think, oh, I'm giving away the secrets. I'm giving away everything. If you feel like you're giving away everything that you know in one conversation, then you should probably switch businesses. But I have no issue talking to people and saying, hey, this is what you should do because number one, I know that most of the times they're not going to actually take action on what I'm telling them.

Napoleon Hill said that when he was teaching the principles of success, he told so many people, and one of the things that blew him away was how many people didn't listen, which is why he gave everything away because he knew nobody would listen. But the 1 percent that did would be the ones that changed the world. But in this case of building out your own business and building out relationships, don't go into it [thinking], what can I give, what can I give, what can I give? It should come naturally to you. But also don't go into it thinking, what can I take, what can I take, what can I take?

A great example was, I was recently in Washington, DC, for a [Meta Boost] gathering. Facebook was gracious enough to fly me and some other business owners out there. I'm meeting with these small business owners and I'm thinking to myself, man, the things that I think are simple are actually quite complex to somebody for the first time. Okay, let me go ahead and share this with them. I had no issue going up and being like, hey, did you know you can do this? Did you know you can post this reel? Did you know you can apply for verification? Did you know you could do this? I'm just having conversations and I'm not thinking to myself, oh, now I'm expecting [something from] you.

I feel like you're obligated to send me business. But honestly, the people who refer you the most business are not going to be your clients. They're going to be the strangers that you helped that just so happen to know somebody. Your clients send you business. But building out those relationships and not anticipating to just get, get, get is how people properly perceive you. You have to realize too how people are perceiving you. If you come in and take, take, take, they're going to say, ah, he's just an asshole. I don't want to work with him. He likes to hear himself talk. So relationship building is a massive, massive part.

Don't be afraid to impart your knowledge. Don't be afraid to do that. Don't be afraid to create competition for yourself. Imitation is the best form of flattery. I've heard that a million different times and [there's] honest truth to it.

Isaac Mashman42:22

Richard, and thank you for picking up a copy and, you know, giving it a read and keeping it by your bedside table. I'm grateful for that, man. So I wrote my first book, Personal Branding: A Manifesto on Fame and Influence, which you can see right now if you're watching the video. If not, you can go to isaacmashman.com forward slash book. But I wrote the book to kind of explain the what and why of personal branding. I didn't know I was explaining the what and why at first. What I originally wrote it for was to raise awareness around the subject that a lot of people heard about, but didn't really understand.

I didn't write it to be some extensive strategical book, like I mentioned earlier. But I [meant] it to kind of start getting you to think about it, getting you to think about, hey, how every single interaction that you have adds up over time. The other day I was in Walmart getting [my tires] changed with the lady. It just so happened, the guy who was sitting across from us that I was starting to talk to, who was a part of a roofing company, went to school for public relations. I got his card. There's no telling how that relationship will work out in the future. On his way out, I'm like, hey, by the way, your website's available for your name.

He's like, seriously? I'm like, yeah, go buy your website. I'm not looking to see what I'm getting. I'm just giving. Naturally, the relationship will show the fruits. But I wrote the book, Personal Branding: A Manifesto on Fame and Influence, to raise the awareness and to explain what personal branding is and why it's important. Then I start getting into the how a little bit. But you'd be amazed at how many people have the misconceptions that it's something that they have to create. It's something that doesn't exist, or it's something that is the same as their company brand. This is another [one], that's massive. A lot of people think that their company brand is the same as their personal brand.

It's not. They're two separate entities. So just covering those different things. My current focus right now is building out Mashman Ventures, building out the consultant team, continuing to scale the personal brand as well and ultimately living the life that I need to live. I'm not one of the guys who's like, my purpose is to save the manatees. My purpose is to live up to my own potential. I know if I want to save the manatees afterwards, I'll be able to do so. Obviously some other things, and having amazing conversations with people like you, Richard.

Isaac Mashman44:40

Yeah. Man, I'm loving you, Richard. I'm loving you. It's called Chase the Vision with Isaac Mashman. I published that in 2019. Man, June 10th is the three year anniversary, and the premise of that show is ultimately just, it's an education, self development show. It's not business primarily, but a lot of the things that I talk about are business. But the premise of the show is to help another person become more capable, from learning from the things that I've learned in life and business. Relationships, for example, relationship building, how to network, what you can do to kind of break away from sitting behind the computer all day, go out in nature, sharing my life.

It's not just one of the business podcasts that only talks about business, and that's super niche. I don't like to niche. That's never been my thing. But Chase the Vision with Isaac Mashman is available on every single streaming platform, just like your own show. I actually had the pleasure of interviewing Zachary Babcock and Dennis Yu. So we have a lot of overlap in our networks, which is really exciting. Both of those conversations were exceptional. Just recently I was on TJ Bradfield's podcast, who's a part of the group [with Tim Humboldt].

Isaac Mashman46:46

The more information you can put out there about you, [the better]. I had to do the hand gestures for a specific reason there because a lot of times, and this is one of the things when I'm talking to clients, they're thinking, I don't want to put my birthday out there. I don't want to put where I was born. I don't want to do any of that. One of the first things I did when I was starting to consciously build out my personal brand was reverse engineer the personal brands of the highest, most successful business people, celebrities, all of the above. One of the things that I noticed was if you go to certain actors' profiles, like Tom Cruise, you're able to find Tom Cruise's height.

You're able to find where Janet Jackson went to high school. So I'm like, why don't I put that information out there? So I'm not saying that you have to necessarily put all that info on your LinkedIn profile or anything, but you need to have a bio that covers the who, what, when, where, and why. That was one of the things you were taught in school, [and in] college. Who, what, when, and why. You need to share that. So who are you? Where are you from? What are you doing? [Why would] somebody want to follow [you]? And then a call to action. Having a website, having follow-me [links] on other social media platforms.

If you have a separate company that you're building, create separate company pages. So on LinkedIn, for example, you have the ability to create a company page. On Facebook, you're able to create a business page. On Instagram, create a second account for your business. I would say go as far as creating a second page for your podcast if you have a podcast. Or if you have a book, create a book brand as well, because you're not always going to be promoting all of the different things about your personal brand on your personal profile. Because then it can, I don't want to use the term and say that it can flood your feed, but it can look messy.

But if you have a separate book profile and a separate podcast profile, you're able to share it as many times as you want, and the people who are following you are your core group of supporters. Now that's an aggressive strategy, but some tips. Make sure your bio is filled out. Make sure you have a website. I would go, whatever your name is, Richard Kaufman, make sure you own Richard Kaufman dot com. Make sure that all of your social media handles are the same. Make sure that your profile pictures are high quality. It shows the whites of your eyes. There's a speech that I learned in high school.

I believe it was one of the generals at the Battle of Gettysburg. He said you were able to see the whites of one another's eyes, and for whatever reason that stuck with me all these years later because now I'm thinking to myself, whenever you have a profile picture, I need to be able to see your face. I need to be able to see you. Your header image should be high quality. Whenever you have the ability to fill out a field, fill out the field, because the more complete it is, the better. Because whenever somebody goes to your profile, they need to be able to find information about you.

For example, if you're a creep like Richard, waiting to see who's going to be on whose podcast, they're going to need to have all that information. The more that you can give, the better the questions that they can ask, especially if you're getting on podcasts, getting into the media. The better you look from a psychological standpoint, it's a first impression. It kills me how many times you see the LinkedIn Premium users and you see they haven't been active in 90 days. I've seen that so many times. I'm like, do you even know you're paying for LinkedIn Premium? It's such a waste. But no, yeah, take those little steps, fill out all your profiles, diversify your content and start creating content that's kind of based around you and your life and your business.

Isaac Mashman51:42

I think you gave them away right there, and that's to treat it like a business. Don't treat it like it's some hobby. A lot of times people start a show and they don't even know why they're spending time building a show and it makes no sense to me. I don't know, that wouldn't be my hobby. You need to have an intention behind your podcast. Are you trying to raise awareness? Are you trying to make money? Are you trying to go ahead and build out your personal brand? Are you trying to use your podcast to get in touch with people that are normally out of touch?

That's a great use for a podcast because now you have a platform where, for example, I know Steve Sims, and to this day I still don't know what he does. I've been connected with him for probably over a year, but I know that he charges $750 for half an hour of time. So he's spending $1,500 to spend time with you on a podcast. But he's not charging you, and now you're having a conversation picking his brain. So you can have a podcast for selfish reasons. But if you want to start a podcast, go into it with the end in mind. You never know when you're going to stop your show.

However, you know when you're [likely to stop], and that's after 20 episodes, and you're not going to get more than 20 listens, probably, on your first episode, unless you work with Zachary Babcock's team. If you launch your show the right way, then you'll get a lot more listeners. But the average show never surpasses 20 episodes and 20 listens per [episode]. So if you don't hit those numbers, don't feel depressed. It takes time. Make sure that you get on a bunch of platforms as well. I couldn't help but have this conversation with Richard before we went live. He's like, I did 300 episodes, and my show wasn't on Apple Podcasts.

I'm like, Richard, what the hell, man? But that's the thing. These platforms are here to serve you. I will be saying this probably until the day I die. Algorithms are pro-creator, anti-consumer. They want to keep you on the platform. But you have to be on the platform to begin with if you want to stay on it and you want to get people hooked into your content. So don't just rely on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, but if you want to [grow], get on international platforms such as [Gaana] in India or [iVoox] in Latin American countries. You could also go and get it distributed to SoundCloud and [Audiomack].

So distribution channels are important. The professionalism is important. I'm not saying you need to be a white collar guy and make the cover art [show] you in a suit and tie. But there are a lot of these different things. Your cover art for your show should have your face on it. It should have your face because I'm listening to you, and I want to be able to put a face to a name. Then don't be afraid to talk about anything and everything. I'm not one of the guys that's super pro niche. I said that earlier today. Niching down is great, but also don't be afraid to shit and giggle sometimes and have a conversation like Richard and I have been having.

Although this is talking about primarily business and personal branding, it's those personal aspects and personal things that you share, those personal stories, that establish rapport with the listener. That rapport adds up over time. Then now they feel like they're a friend of yours. Then eventually they could very well become a friend of yours. So yeah, some overlapping questions, Richard, you're asking me so many different questions. I'm like, man, you could literally write a book off of all this.

Isaac Mashman55:52

Yeah, yeah. Well, and it's like you can still be somebody who's out of reach, quote-unquote, like a celebrity, and you could still share things about your story. That's why Kim Kardashian is a great example. People know all of her kids' names. They know where she's from. They know every ounce of detail about her and it's like she's still a celebrity. So sharing one of these things every now and again is not going to affect you. It's going to give a reason for somebody to support you even more because it extends past [the business]. I can't help but think about the guys who are only being known for funnels.

Go to their Facebook profile. It's like funnel builder, digital coach. They don't have anything else on it. They don't have anything that shares who they are. Imagine if they pivot, if they hate their business and they want to switch it up. Everybody who's following them for the funnels, they're going to unfollow them because now they're no longer getting value. But if they were following him for who he is, or for who she is, then it doesn't matter what business you're in because people are still going to be supporting you. Because you're the man, you're the woman, you're the individual that people know, like, and trust.

So Richard, it's been great being on the show, man, you asked some really great questions, fantastic conversation. I'm glad we could make this happen.

Isaac Mashman57:33

Yeah, you can find me everywhere at Isaac Mashman, and go to my website, Isaac Mashman dot com. Run a quick Google search, everything that you need will be right there. And Richard.